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Where to survive a global societal collapse?

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  • Where to survive a global societal collapse?

    Quite an interesting report

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ietal-collapse

    New Zealand was no surprise at all.
    VERY surprised about the UK being on the list, apparently 'has the ability to withstand shocks' (whatever that means).
    There are quite a few NSFW jokes by Frankie Boyle on this topic that I won't repeat here, most of them involve being in the burned out remains of an Asda car park.

    An interesting question for me would be - what constitutes an actual 'collapse'?
    The fall of international institutions, complete meltdown of financial markets, or something similar?

  • #2
    The UK relies on food imports to survive, and doesn't produce that much stuff. It's pretty self sufficient for electricity and water though

    I guess it depends on how bad the collapse is. Just global trade? Society in general? Because in either case the more remote and primitive place the better as they tend to be pretty self sufficient anyway. Tropical islands, deep in rainforests etc will let people survive of the flora and fauna with minimal equipment.

    The UK would suck because farming by hand is horrible and outside of the remote places there's not going to be any real foraging/hunting and you're going to need more stuff to survive the winters.
    There's probably enough stuff here to last years assuming a suitable drop in population, but the weather is likely to result in a lot of equipment rusting (albeit not so quickly if they don't salt the roads over winter).


    We're too integrated and comfortable now to do any real survival beyond looting shops for tinned food and batteries. I mean, could any of us go back to the stone age and even manage to produce iron let alone make anything useful with it?

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    • #3
      Not surprised to see Iceland on there. You have complete energy self-sufficiency from a renewable source, which also provides all the hot water you need. That energy allows you to heat greenhouses and grow pretty much whatever you want (they grow bananas on Iceland, for example).

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      • #4
        California is a massive food producer…but relies on others for water. There’s four million people between my family and any foraging. Most likely our deaths will be quick and brutal.

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        • #5
          This all sounds like a big bag of bollocks. So much hypothetical at work I could use it to build a space rocket and go survive the collapse on Ultramar!

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          • #6
            I live very close to a strategically important military target, so in the event of any kind of nuclear exchange, I think I will be lucky enough to be vaporized immediately.

            In terms of a different kind of collapse, I don't think I'd do well here - water would be problematic.

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            • #7
              I think we are well beyond the point, population wise, where much of the developed world could feed itself if we had a complete collapse of civilisation.

              But it's interesting to think what might happen if we took a few steps short of that; Let's say, collapse of international rules-based order. If there was some sort of (non-nuclear) war between major powers, or a solar flare that wiped out most international communication. Perhaps a plague so terrible that international travel was shut down altogether (actually, scrap that, I don't want to think what would happen to the UK in that circumstance!) So countries could theoretically survive independently but most international trade was brought to a stand-still.

              Originally posted by Ouze View Post
              I live very close to a strategically important military target, so in the event of any kind of nuclear exchange, I think I will be lucky enough to be vaporized immediately.

              In terms of a different kind of collapse, I don't think I'd do well here - water would be problematic.
              I used to live near a small town in the UK called Cheltenham (which is on the edge of the Cotswolds, if you have heard of that). Really small spa town (probably less than 100k people).

              I had heard a story that during the Cuban Missile Crisis at one point things were looking so dire that Kennedy and Khruschchev had actually handed lists to each other of the top nuclear targets in each other's countries so that evacuations of people could begin. Apparently the top nuclear target in Europe? Not London, but Cheltenham. It was because of GCHQ of course, the HQ of the UK's intelligence and communications network. My parents lived just a few miles down the road from there, so at least probably wouldn't have realised what was happening..

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              • #8
                I have to laugh about billionaires buying land to build bunkers in New Zealand, what good is your bunker going to do when shit goes down and you're half the world away?

                I wonder what kind of collapse is worth living through, because you might quickly end up envying the dead so to speak.

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                • #9
                  The will to live live I suppose. It really depends on the type of societal collapse. I mean a pandemic puts a totally different strain on logistic strains than a non nuclear world war or a full blown socialist uprising.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Pacific View Post
                    I used to live near a small town in the UK called Cheltenham (which is on the edge of the Cotswolds, if you have heard of that). Really small spa town (probably less than 100k people).

                    I had heard a story that during the Cuban Missile Crisis at one point things were looking so dire that Kennedy and Khruschchev had actually handed lists to each other of the top nuclear targets in each other's countries so that evacuations of people could begin. Apparently the top nuclear target in Europe? Not London, but Cheltenham. It was because of GCHQ of course, the HQ of the UK's intelligence and communications network. My parents lived just a few miles down the road from there, so at least probably wouldn't have realised what was happening..
                    I've always been under the impression that the primary nuclear target in the UK is generally considered to be Rosyth, where Trident is based.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Disciple of Fate View Post
                      I have to laugh about billionaires buying land to build bunkers in New Zealand, what good is your bunker going to do when shit goes down and you're half the world away?

                      I wonder what kind of collapse is worth living through, because you might quickly end up envying the dead so to speak.
                      The other question: you're a billionaire, and you have financed a bunker full of food, weapons, supplies, and everything needed to say safe. Obviously this site is full of armed people to keep the site safe and protect you.

                      .... why would any of these people continue to keep you safe and protect you? What is your money worth anymore?

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                      • Shinypixe
                        Shinypixe commented
                        Editing a comment
                        If you believe random internet comments, they plan to put essentially shock collars on their staff. But then again, it's random internet comments. Even if they tried, all it takes is one broken device and Melon Rusk's bunker becomes Colonel Kurtz's bunker.

                    • #12
                      It sure seems odd relying on the social contract when making plans for the collapse of said society.

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                      • #13
                        Originally posted by Disciple of Fate View Post
                        I have to laugh about billionaires buying land to build bunkers in New Zealand, what good is your bunker going to do when shit goes down and you're half the world away?
                        Because Vault-Tec already knows ahead of time when it will happen, so they can give the secret advance warnings to the rich and powerful. :P
                        To me, the biggest problem with all these fancy vaults/bunkers is that you just know the water chip (or something similar and equally vital) is going to break early on and nobody thought to include a spare.

                        Anyway, if there were a total collapse, my days will be numbered for sure. I had a total thyroidectomy a couple years ago, so I need the thyroid meds to live. A depressing thing to think about, when you need a specific medication to live and think about what might happen if you can't get it.

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                        • Haighus
                          Haighus commented
                          Editing a comment
                          That is a difficult one. It may work if you eat a lot of pig thyroids, although the dosing would be guesswork.

                          I'm gonna look that up.

                        • Haighus
                          Haighus commented
                          Editing a comment
                          Ok, turns out dried thyroids from cows and pigs was the treatment before synthetic thyroxine.

                          You would need to find mammals to eat.

                        • Too Hot To Trot
                          Too Hot To Trot commented
                          Editing a comment
                          Well, there'll be plenty of previously rich people around...

                      • #14
                        Originally posted by Disciple of Fate View Post
                        I have to laugh about billionaires buying land to build bunkers in New Zealand, what good is your bunker going to do when shit goes down and you're half the world away?

                        I wonder what kind of collapse is worth living through, because you might quickly end up envying the dead so to speak.
                        My guess is they think they managed to swindle the society so far, so they will swindle their way into safety. Because as we know, nature accepts bribes.

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                        • #15
                          Originally posted by Disciple of Fate View Post
                          I have to laugh about billionaires buying land to build bunkers in New Zealand, what good is your bunker going to do when shit goes down and you're half the world away?
                          It depends on how quickly the collapse happens; there's probably going to be time to make it to the private jet.

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